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Better brakes - options?
Moderators: KeithZ1R, chrisu, paul doran, Taffus
Better brakes - options?
On my to do list for resurrecting my Z1 is improving the front brakes.
Currently it has original 1970s discs which are hopeless in the wet. On my Z1000 I fitted EBC discs and that improved the wet braking markedly - there was no longer a 2 second wait for the brakes to work!
The braking in the dry on the Z1 seems pretty poor compared to modern brakes (hardly surprising with 50 years development since the Z1 hit the road!) so I was wondering whether there was an affordable caliper upgrade.
I see that Webike in Japan offer a kit of discs and what look like AP callipers, plus adapters for about $1800 US before shipping.
I have a pair of blue spot Yamaha callipers, but doubt that they can be made to fit.
I’m keeping the original front wheel and forks (albeit hopefully with Maxton internals): what do people recommend?
Currently it has original 1970s discs which are hopeless in the wet. On my Z1000 I fitted EBC discs and that improved the wet braking markedly - there was no longer a 2 second wait for the brakes to work!
The braking in the dry on the Z1 seems pretty poor compared to modern brakes (hardly surprising with 50 years development since the Z1 hit the road!) so I was wondering whether there was an affordable caliper upgrade.
I see that Webike in Japan offer a kit of discs and what look like AP callipers, plus adapters for about $1800 US before shipping.
I have a pair of blue spot Yamaha callipers, but doubt that they can be made to fit.
I’m keeping the original front wheel and forks (albeit hopefully with Maxton internals): what do people recommend?
2019R1250GS....
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
- warren3200gt
- Hardcore
- Posts: 2899
- Joined: 13th Jun 2014
- Location: Dartford Kent
Re: Better brakes - options?
Braided hoses make a huge difference. I can lock the front wheel with stock discs and calipers with full braided hoses.
PUM 488 June 2023
76 Z900A4, 77 Z650B1, 77 KZ650B1, 77 Z1000A1, 82 Z1000J2, ZRX1100R.
76 Z900A4, 77 Z650B1, 77 KZ650B1, 77 Z1000A1, 82 Z1000J2, ZRX1100R.
Re: Better brakes - options?
New pads can make quite a difference, and degreasing the discs after you wash the bike. It's always a good idea to make sure the stock kit is in good condition before judging whether or not its inadequate.
Other than that, I noticed that the bolt hole spacing on my z1000a1 was probably the same as that on unitrac calipers. Unitrac calipers work well and are a decent upgrade over earlier kit. Might be something worth looking at if you want to engineer something yourself on the cheap.
If ebc discs worked well for you before then you might as well do it again with fresh pads and fluid. Got to be a good start.
Olly
Other than that, I noticed that the bolt hole spacing on my z1000a1 was probably the same as that on unitrac calipers. Unitrac calipers work well and are a decent upgrade over earlier kit. Might be something worth looking at if you want to engineer something yourself on the cheap.
If ebc discs worked well for you before then you might as well do it again with fresh pads and fluid. Got to be a good start.
Olly
'In your twenties you think you are immortal, in your thirties you hope you are immortal, in your forties you just hope it doesn't hurt too much'
Lemmy
Lemmy
Re: Better brakes - options?
I use AP calipers on my lawson and endurance bike, absolutely fantastic. You will need adapter plates making, which is pretty straightforward. No doubt someone on here will have a set for you to copy. Not overly expensive for what you get. Grimeca do copies which are cheaper, but just as good.
Rob
Rob
Z1100R, RD 125LC, Zx7r , Endurance racer, zx4rr
Re: Better brakes - options?
I have AP racing calipers on brackets on my Z1000A2, a lot better than stock.
adrianhorsfield@live.co.uk
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Re: Better brakes - options?
Thanks chaps, all useful advice, as usual.
I’ll try to find a pair of AP calipers. Currently the bike has Z900 forks, wheel and calipers, and I have only a single Z1 caliper and disc, so would need to source a second disc and Caliper whatever I do (assuming that I want a double disc setup - which seems like a no brainier if one is going to ride “enthusiastically”).
Currently there is no splitter, the two calipers are each fed by a long dedicated braided hose from the master cylinder. I was planning on reintroducing a splitter but using braided hoses rather than historically correct hoses, but what’s the opinion about that?
And is the original two-disc master cylinder a sensible choice for use with AP calipers - or should I plan on changing the master cylinder too?
@Adrian H, what do you use with your APs?
I’ll try to find a pair of AP calipers. Currently the bike has Z900 forks, wheel and calipers, and I have only a single Z1 caliper and disc, so would need to source a second disc and Caliper whatever I do (assuming that I want a double disc setup - which seems like a no brainier if one is going to ride “enthusiastically”).
Currently there is no splitter, the two calipers are each fed by a long dedicated braided hose from the master cylinder. I was planning on reintroducing a splitter but using braided hoses rather than historically correct hoses, but what’s the opinion about that?
And is the original two-disc master cylinder a sensible choice for use with AP calipers - or should I plan on changing the master cylinder too?
@Adrian H, what do you use with your APs?
2019R1250GS....
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
Re: Better brakes - options?
A few too many typos tonight… a few too many beers perhaps? It is 10pm here in Bangkok!
2019R1250GS....
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
Re: Better brakes - options?
EBC discs.Strebe wrote:@Adrian H, what do you use with your APs?
I could mark up a template of the brackets if you like.
adrianhorsfield@live.co.uk
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
- Z1streetfighter71
- Custard Cream
- Posts: 752
- Joined: 16th Oct 2020
- Location: Galway-Eire
Re: Better brakes - options?
Iv been hovering over buying a set myself here are linls to buy the AP
https://www.part-box.com/product/ap-alu ... 2696-38e0/
and the Grimeca copies
https://www.britishbikebits.com/ap-racing-alloy-caliper
If some one has an adapter that they can share the measurements too i can CAD it out and share no problems.
https://www.part-box.com/product/ap-alu ... 2696-38e0/
and the Grimeca copies
https://www.britishbikebits.com/ap-racing-alloy-caliper
If some one has an adapter that they can share the measurements too i can CAD it out and share no problems.
Re: Better brakes - options?
Z1streetfighter71 wrote:Iv been hovering over buying a set myself here are linls to buy the AP
https://www.part-box.com/product/ap-alu ... 2696-38e0/
and the Grimeca copies
https://www.britishbikebits.com/ap-racing-alloy-caliper
If some one has an adapter that they can share the measurements too i can CAD it out and share no problems.
I can provide a CAD file if needed - just would need to know which type of CAD file required. IE dwg, dxf.
adrianhorsfield@live.co.uk
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Re: Better brakes - options?
I use the AP master cylinder on my Lawson and a zrx one on the endurance bike, both work well and look good
Rob
Rob
Z1100R, RD 125LC, Zx7r , Endurance racer, zx4rr
- Z1streetfighter71
- Custard Cream
- Posts: 752
- Joined: 16th Oct 2020
- Location: Galway-Eire
Re: Better brakes - options?
ADRIAN H wrote:Z1streetfighter71 wrote:Iv been hovering over buying a set myself here are linls to buy the AP
https://www.part-box.com/product/ap-alu ... 2696-38e0/
and the Grimeca copies
https://www.britishbikebits.com/ap-racing-alloy-caliper
If some one has an adapter that they can share the measurements too i can CAD it out and share no problems.
I can provide a CAD file if needed - just would need to know which type of CAD file required. IE dwg, dxf.
If i could get a copy in DWG or DXF i would be able to add that to my next laser cut, what mm plate did you make them from?
Re: Better brakes - options?
I bought them from this forum. They are made from 10mm plate.
adrianhorsfield@live.co.uk
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
Sunny Bournemouth. Dorset. UK.
- Z1streetfighter71
- Custard Cream
- Posts: 752
- Joined: 16th Oct 2020
- Location: Galway-Eire
Re: Better brakes - options?
ADRIAN H wrote:I bought them from this forum. They are made from 10mm plate.
Ah ok. i wont be treading on any toes reproducing them? i need about 6 made you see.
Re: Better brakes - options?
Thanks for the further information, and for the possibility of some aster brackets.
Adrian H, nice bike! I’ll be using Z1 forks: do your CAD files cope with that?
And us that a standard Kawasaki master cylinder I see?
These people seem to offer Grimeca calipers for £125 plus vat, with pads extra.
https://www.triumph-spares.co.uk/grimec ... s-gri-0001
@Z1streetfighter, if you were able to knock up a couple of extra brackets I’d gladly pay for your time and materials.
Adrian H, nice bike! I’ll be using Z1 forks: do your CAD files cope with that?
And us that a standard Kawasaki master cylinder I see?
These people seem to offer Grimeca calipers for £125 plus vat, with pads extra.
https://www.triumph-spares.co.uk/grimec ... s-gri-0001
@Z1streetfighter, if you were able to knock up a couple of extra brackets I’d gladly pay for your time and materials.
2019R1250GS....
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
1974Z1B, 1975 RD350B
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