Hello Guest User,

Please feel free to have a look around the forum but be aware that as an unregistered guest you can't see all of it and you can't post.

To access these 'Registered Users Only' areas simply register and login.

1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

Need help restoring, building, or finding then try here.

Moderators: chrisu, paul doran, Taffus, KeithZ1R

Message
Author
User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#16 PostAuthor: PJONO » Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:10 pm

Well .. New cam chain installed. New rubber rollers . New front and rear tensioner. Sadly but unsurprisingly the noise remains. Con rod three was exhibiting a little more lateral movement than the other rods but there was no vertical movement. Little ends lovely. Theres no noise in the front of the motor and the bike runs really well.Checked all related cogs etc. Nothing obvious. Changed starter clutch bearings and checked rotor integrity. All good there.

The source of the noise seemingly is in the rear of the motor and is not linked to increasing speed or gear shifting. It doesn't go when in any particular gear. Doesn't disappear when clutch in or out. Doesn't go when slack on clutch taken in but not activated.

Obviously this now leads me into the engine cases. A quick check is Sump off and a look up inside from below ...so to speak.

Q. Are Z1's prone to oil pumps going and exhibiting noise as described earlier?

Also going to check clutch plates and any lash on outer drum before the journey in.

Any thoughts let me know. -Certainly looking like a rip down though don't we think? Not bothered if I have to . Just be a pain if its the oil pump that can be accessed from below.

User avatar
chrisNI
Site Admin
Posts: 3694
Joined: 22nd Dec 2001
Location: NI

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#17 PostAuthor: chrisNI » Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:24 pm

Out of interest how many miles is on it and is it a confirmed mileage ie supported by MOTs?
Doesnt really sound like oil pump. It sounds like an engine out job - if it's gearbox and that noisy it shoud be obvious once you open it up and look at the bearings, and just repacing the gearbox bearings and closing it all up again would be relatively simple if that's what it is, though if you're doing that you might as well refurb the clutch at the same time...

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#18 PostAuthor: PJONO » Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:35 pm

Hi, Thanks for thoughts. Original KMH speedo shows 60,000 KM's. Who knows whether its the original. May or may not be.
Pretty sure-ish its a bearing in the gearbox. The only thing that would lead me away from that is that the sound seems to be occurring at a different speed to increasing decreasing engine revs/different speed ratio. Suggesting cam chain circuit or some other component that isn't directly synchronous to the increasing or decreasing revs. Hence thought of oil pump. Might have a look in anyway from sump . I'm hoping theres some evidence in there that might help me determine source.

User avatar
zed1015
Hardcore
Hardcore
Posts: 3798
Joined: 2nd Nov 2005
Location: Somewhere between Scunny and Goole.

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#19 PostAuthor: zed1015 » Sun Dec 16, 2018 11:51 pm

To help isolate the noise you need to have the bike stationary but running and in gear with the clutch disengaged.
This will prevent any gearbox components from rotating.
If the noise disappears it's gearbox related and if not then you know to look at the crank etc.
I would check that the starter motor is not being driven when the engine is running as this makes the kind of whining noise you describe.
This is caused by the starter clutch gear not freewheeling as it should.

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#20 PostAuthor: PJONO » Mon Dec 17, 2018 12:02 am

Hi , Thanks for getting back.Understand your test suggestions. Sound remains when bike ridden. Be helpful for me to add that the noise is not constant- in that not there all time. Its repetitive in that it disappears for a few moments and then reccurs for a few moments. But does that constantly. Just doesn't seem cranky. One suggestion is that the bike may have been stood and the crank roller bearings have rusted. -just doesn't seem like a crank generated noise though.
P

baz
100Club
100Club
Posts: 382
Joined: 23rd Jun 2009
Location: leyland

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#21 PostAuthor: baz » Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:52 am

does the noise get any worse when you lean the bike over from one side to the other ?

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#22 PostAuthor: PJONO » Mon Dec 17, 2018 9:21 am

Will certainly check. Going to have another look today. Trying to prevent myself dismantling motor before Christmas! Wife is repeatedly reminding me it wouldn’t be seen as an appropriate festive act !!!

User avatar
gpjes
100Club
100Club
Posts: 230
Joined: 13th May 2013
Location: Bingley West Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#23 PostAuthor: gpjes » Mon Dec 17, 2018 7:20 pm

Not always there, ooerr missus, could be a bearing spinning in housing and theres a few to go at in gearbox, but not expensive, good set of quality pullers is more expensive. and it is a giant meccanno kit motor, unlike the liquid cooled puppies, just remember to not land yourself in the shit with the missus, have a good one. :idea
More Smiles Per Mile

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#24 PostAuthor: PJONO » Wed Dec 19, 2018 1:04 pm

Well. Took off the clutch cover today to discover one of the clutch spring posts on the aluminium clutch centre hub Has been broken off .Simply not there. Bike been running with one short.
Don’t think this is the source of the noise but it can't help =suggest hub would be out of balance gyroscopically . Obtained new / second hand clutch. Will install and report accordingly. Assuming I can get the hub off.

User avatar
gpjes
100Club
100Club
Posts: 230
Joined: 13th May 2013
Location: Bingley West Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#25 PostAuthor: gpjes » Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:48 pm

Are there any signs of damage? My GPZ I sold on here had one of those that let go and some so called engineer stripped and cleaned it out, but I guess never did the oilpump so the motor with only 20 thou, on it nipped the crank trust me that little assembly of the spring the bolt and washer in a spinning motor causes untold damage internally, I do have piccies to prove :eek
More Smiles Per Mile

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#26 PostAuthor: PJONO » Fri Dec 21, 2018 7:16 pm

Second hand clutch installed, Engine noise still present but clutch much nicer....progress. Will take sump off in due course and inspect pump. Still think its bearing but you never know. It might be a Christmas miracle!

Adrian90s
100Club
100Club
Posts: 354
Joined: 6th Nov 2018
Location: Wakefield

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#27 PostAuthor: Adrian90s » Sun Dec 23, 2018 8:51 am

Barnsley?
Sounds like my brother 's Z1a, green? Top end noise ? Asking £12,500
USA import and had it 5-6yrs, don't know what he paid but I liked it so much that I've just bought one even though I'm a BMW man

User avatar
gpjes
100Club
100Club
Posts: 230
Joined: 13th May 2013
Location: Bingley West Yorkshire

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#28 PostAuthor: gpjes » Sun Dec 23, 2018 9:41 am

Yours is there all the time, I went with my mate to have a look, so hopefully you've put a new back tyre on :lol: it just might be general wear and cured by shimming or cams, easy fix, the motor has been out on yours, it has very close numbers, and is very nice, buy a proper bike bench ho ho, look after it!
More Smiles Per Mile

Adrian90s
100Club
100Club
Posts: 354
Joined: 6th Nov 2018
Location: Wakefield

Re: 1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#29 PostAuthor: Adrian90s » Sun Dec 23, 2018 1:09 pm

New back tyre on mine or my brothers in Barnsley?

User avatar
PJONO
100Club
100Club
Posts: 105
Joined: 13th Jun 2018
Location: North Yorkshire

1973 Z1-NOISE IN MOTOR

#30 PostAuthor: PJONO » Sun Dec 23, 2018 7:20 pm

Sump off. No debris to speak of. Usual sludge. Checked oil pump-all good. Had a good look up and at the clusters but nothing obvious. Full gearbox ordered from States just in case. Put it back together. Programmed for strip down in New Year.


Return to “Bike Help”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 94 guests