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z1000 starting problem

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roborm
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z1000 starting problem

#1 PostAuthor: roborm » Fri May 17, 2019 7:22 am

I would be grateful for any help with this one please.
It starts from hot and cold on the kickstart but not the starter.
The starter spins the engine over and sometimes starts when hot but mostly not.
I have checked the points, plugs and coils (which have all been renewed in recent years). I have also checked all related wiring connections. Battery is good and charged. Alternator was also renewed.
Spark is not that good but when it starts it runs well.
Any ideas please?

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warren3200gt
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#2 PostAuthor: warren3200gt » Fri May 17, 2019 8:05 am

Sounds like your starter is drawing a lot of power not leaving enough for the ignition. I would start by checking out the starter and related wiring. Failing that try the wired George mod to power the coils direct from the battery.
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#3 PostAuthor: ADRIAN H » Fri May 17, 2019 1:02 pm

Fit a combined Regulator / Rectifier ? But check power outage first.
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roborm
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#4 PostAuthor: roborm » Sat May 18, 2019 6:33 am

Thanks for the replies. It has a modern regulator/rectifier fitted and I have checked the starter wiring including the solenoid. But how do I check the starter without taking it off?
Also will try wired George mod if not starter.
Thanks

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#5 PostAuthor: warren3200gt » Sat May 18, 2019 2:08 pm

Electrics are not my strongest area but you should be able to check how many amps the starter is drawing if you have a multimeter. Could be a dirty armature which is an easy clean and fix.
What type and how old is your battery. It can read 12v and only deliver a few amps. Along with the wg mod a new known good battery never hurts!
PUM 488 June 2
76 Z900A4, 77 Z650B1, 77 KZ650B1, 77 Z1000A1, 82 Z1000J2, 89 ZXR750H1, ZRX1100R.

roborm
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#6 PostAuthor: roborm » Sun May 19, 2019 8:13 am

It has a newish gel type battery which when charged indicates 12.8v on a meter. I won't buy the traditional lead/acid anymore as non of them last.
The Clymer does not give any info on testing the starter eg what current it should be drawing.
Perhaps I could try a car battery with jump leads.
Thanks for your help.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#7 PostAuthor: warren3200gt » Sun May 19, 2019 10:09 am

Before jumping from a car battery give Dave at cybike a ring and discuss with him. There is a chance a car battery could burn something out and Dave is pretty good with lecky stuff.
PUM 488 June 2
76 Z900A4, 77 Z650B1, 77 KZ650B1, 77 Z1000A1, 82 Z1000J2, 89 ZXR750H1, ZRX1100R.

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chrisNI
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#8 PostAuthor: chrisNI » Sun May 19, 2019 9:25 pm

Try putting the meter on the battery terminals and churn over the starter and see what the battery voltage drops to under load. It shouldn’t drop that much really not much below 12 - I’ve seen bikes with that issue and the battery voltage went through the floor down to 6 or 7 under load then jumped back to 12 volts.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#9 PostAuthor: Pigford » Mon May 20, 2019 7:33 am

chrisNI wrote:Try putting the meter on the battery terminals and churn over the starter and see what the battery voltage drops to under load. It shouldn’t drop that much really not much below 12 - I’ve seen bikes with that issue and the battery voltage went through the floor down to 6 or 7 under load then jumped back to 12 volts.



This, I think you’ll find battery voltage drops well below 12v on starting ?
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Re: z1000 starting problem

#10 PostAuthor: chrisNI » Mon May 20, 2019 8:31 am

On that Bandit the new battery that was actually able to start it didn’t drop to anything like the same extent... :shock: the dodgy battery was showing twelve bolts plus unless it was under load, press the starter and all the lights dimmed and it wouldn’t spin the motor at all but then would show 12v again.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#11 PostAuthor: roborm » Wed May 22, 2019 4:46 am

Sorry for delay in replying have been away. Ok thanks will speak to Dave at Cybike and check voltage drop at battery when using starter. I will let you know what happens.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#12 PostAuthor: ZedHead » Wed May 22, 2019 10:42 am

warren3200gt wrote:Before jumping from a car battery give Dave at cybike a ring and discuss with him. There is a chance a car battery could burn something out and Dave is pretty good with lecky stuff.


Did you ever get your tacho working mate?

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#13 PostAuthor: warren3200gt » Wed May 22, 2019 11:27 am

ZedHead wrote:Did you ever get your tacho working mate?


I did, thanks Dave. Only one minor issue, for some reason the 2 orange LED's seem to be on really really faintly all the time the ignition is on regardless of rev's. Didn't even notice it until a night ride they are that faint. When I get up to 7 or 8k rpm they come on full so I can live with that. I think they must be different rating to the green and red.
PUM 488 June 2
76 Z900A4, 77 Z650B1, 77 KZ650B1, 77 Z1000A1, 82 Z1000J2, 89 ZXR750H1, ZRX1100R.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#14 PostAuthor: ZedHead » Wed May 22, 2019 11:53 am

Pigford wrote:
chrisNI wrote:Try putting the meter on the battery terminals and churn over the starter and see what the battery voltage drops to under load. It shouldn’t drop that much really not much below 12 - I’ve seen bikes with that issue and the battery voltage went through the floor down to 6 or 7 under load then jumped back to 12 volts.



This, I think you’ll find battery voltage drops well below 12v on starting ?


It shouldn't.

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Re: z1000 starting problem

#15 PostAuthor: roborm » Tue Jun 04, 2019 8:54 am

I meant to do an update on this issue. I spoke to Dave at Cybike who suggested that it might just be the battery. So I connected a car battery with jump leads and it started.
So bought a motobatt locally and it starts. So many thanks Dave for your help.
Even though the old battery was showing 12.7 volts or so when charged it probably did not produce enough current for the starter and ignition.
I have a lot of trouble with motorbike batteries compared to car batteries and they seem to have a life expectancy of a couple of months if you are lucky, even suppossed reputable brands. I think these companies need to get their act together.
It would be interesting to hear other peoples experiences and thoughts on motorcycle batteries!


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